Your thoughts on Homeschooling?
Spawned by a fiesty debate on the Ridgecrestca.com guestbook!
I have a lot of input on this, I had years of public school, years of private school and one year of homeschool (the school actually sent teachers into my home for some classes, and the other classes I completed by mail).
Here’s my experience: the most difficult, challenging and worthwile education, scholastically speaking, came from the private schools. Any time I transfered out of a private school to a public school I was at least 1 or 2 years ahead of the public curriculum. The classes were smaller, and the uniforms were HORRIBLE, but I would rather see a child in a horrible uniform than a miniskirt.
The human interaction and social skills needed for life come best from a public school. Kids learn to stand up for themselves in a public school, they learn about bullies, crushes, sharing, how to fit in with various groups and cliques. Kids learn personal defense skills.
Regarding home school: it was just too easy. I’d blast through a week of schoolwork in one or two hours and ace the test. Also, there is something important to a youngster about getting up in the morning, getting dressed and Going To School.
My questions, and I’m not knocking homeschool, just trying to fuel the debate:
How well will fully homeschooled kids function when they are 25? Will they know how to share? How to get up every day and get to work? How to handle a bully? How to Scrap if someone tries to mug them?
I volunteered with a coworker of mine years ago, assisting an art teacher who gave an art class after Sunday School for the homeschool kids. They were the most self centered group of kids I’d ever seen. That’s not to say that ALL homeschool students are that way, but they had no idea how to work with eachother, share art supplies, or tolerate another student having a different view of whatever subject they were painting or sculpting.
Finally, I have to say that it comes down to the parents to teach manners, 100%. Parents need to lead by example first, and enforce good manners at home.
Your thoughts?
You pretty much covered the issue. I can only write of what I witnessed while living in Colorado. This
was home schooling by fundamentalist religious
types used as a means of indoctrination. It was always a mousey wife,domineering husband and brain
washed kids. This is a cult. It produces young adults who cannot assimilate into the larger society. So
they gravitate to socialization with other
cult members and continue the destruction of
children thru other generations. The
similarity between this and radical Islam cannot be ignored.
Fred
January 4, 2008
Maybe it’s ultimately better for a child to have a happy home school experience? Happy kids make happy adults make happy families makes a happy nation?
dailyindependent
January 4, 2008
What qualifications does a parent need to homeschool their children?
Chesus K. Reist
January 5, 2008
Honestly to say a home schooled student becomes
a religious cult is ridiculous. Lets try this
aproach what if a child with adhd disruptive
in class were taught at home 1 on 1 better numbers
than 1 to 30. Secondly Ive been private schooled
and public and was 1 to 3 years ahead of ssusd.
Home school may seem easier but you progress at
your own rate. Secondly the curriculumn recommends
you enroll your child in organized sports or music.
It requires the parents to work harder at
parenting.As far as well adjusted as a
homeschooler you could work a job at 16 to
teach work skills.I’ve seen this method
produce well adjusted and very well educated
children.
blfrog
January 5, 2008
Here is an introduction to California Homeschooling: http://www.homefires.com/ca_style.asp
A worldnetdaily article regarding the homeschool issue in California:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=28800
More good info and links for potential homeschoolers… I found this quote here:
No, you do not need workbooks unless they are an educational activity that your child just ADORES. So, if you don’t need workbooks …what should you do all day long? The first step (regardless of whether you plan to use a set curriculum or follow a more unstructured approach) is to allow ample time for you and your child to recover. In other words, don’t do anything that feels like drudgery – yes … do something FUN! “But,” you protest “we’re supposed to be doing something!!” You will be. Go to the library, allow your child to choose books (without you pointing out what she/he likes). Read aloud to your child (regardless of his/her age). Visit museums and go for long walks on the beach (or in the mountains, the desert or more urban environments). Act silly. Cook or bake something new together. Visit with someone who is shut-in. Plant a garden. Most homeschool veterans suggest one month “off” for every year that your child has been in a formal classroom setting. This is only a guideline as every child will have varying needs. Essentially this down time is to make the parent and child realize that learning can take place anywhere and at anytime and is not only limited to what takes place in formal school environments. By doing what seems to be “nothing” for a period of time, you are reclaiming your life as a family and you are also providing yourself with a valuable assessment of your child’s interests and skills.
http://www.bayshoreeducational.com/remove.html
I don’t deny that I still need to learn more about the topic, but again my initial feeling is Utter Disbelief regarding the results of homeschooling. If you’ve been homeschooled, please feel free to throw in your 2 cents!
dailyindependent
January 5, 2008
And after some futher reading and posting, a whole new topic. Unschooling! http://unschoolingblogs.blogspot.com/
dailyindependent
January 5, 2008
Hi!
First of all, I’m delighted that you found your education difficult, challenging, and worthwhile — wherever you received it, whether that be at private school, public school, or home. Speaking as a parent, that is what most parents want for their children, however and wherever they can achieve it. However, I do take issue with the following statement:
“The human interaction and social skills needed for life come best from a public school. Kids learn to stand up for themselves in a public school, they learn about bullies, crushes, sharing, how to fit in with various groups and cliques. Kids learn personal defense skills.”
I don’t doubt that some of these skills can be learned at public school, and for many students, public school’s socialization can be a decent option — even the best option for that particular child.
That said, however, I can’t agree with your statement as a universal truth for every student.
One major assumption you’re making in your statement is that “bullies, crushes, sharing, [and] how to fit in with various groups and cliques” are characteristic only of school and that school is the sole place in which they are to be found. Okay, obviously that’s not true. I don’t want to belabor an oft-belabored point about church groups, 4-H, Scouts, martial arts/athletic/artistic classes, youth softball/soccer organizations, and so on being just as fertile a hunting ground for bullies, cliques, and crushes as school.
The point I think needs to be made here is this: At least for us, at least for our family, I see “socialization” as being a mixed bag at best, certainly *not* a reason to go to school. My opinion very probably will change as our child ages and our child’s needs shift, but when a child is relatively young, I think moving them from the home and expecting them to function appropriately within the weird kids-rule society of school is like constructing a building on a foundation that’s still wet. Still growing, still maturing, still developing and coalescing a unique sense of themselves aside from their parents, children haven’t had their values and ethics — those core elements that form so much of our core selves — fully mastered yet, not even vicariously through literature or film. It’s no wonder that, with their weak foundations, they become subject to the law of force that characterizes much of children’s interactions, in which the big bullies and Queen Bees tend to overpower all but the genuinely stubborn or resistant.
Again, this doesn’t happen with every kid, and of course for many kids, they have fun, find friends, learn to share, and so on — but my point is that especially early on, especially before they’re more developed as selves, full-on “socialization” causes more harm than good, at least for some.
Ultimately, how will homeschoolers handle themselves? I guess it’s really answerable only on a case-by-case, just like with public or private school. One could say, “How will private school students handle the reality of economic difference between themselves — the affluent and economically privileged — and the majority of the rest of the world?” but of course, that would be silly, because the answer would vary from person to person. One can be raised in an atmosphere of privilege and become insensible to the sufferings of others, or one can become Siddhartha. It depends.
Somehow, I think the majority will do just fine.
adsoofmelk
January 5, 2008
Let’s be frank about home schooling. I call it
the ‘Breeding Wars’. Goal being to produce
vast numbers of mind-numbed advocates of Mr Big, in whatever form this requires. Hitler,
Pol Pot,Jesus,Muhammed or Ah Poo who works the night shift at 7-11.
Fred
January 5, 2008
Thanks for posting, however I don’t understand how you’re lumping homeschool children into a group of “affluent” people. Maybe that is the case in your neck of the woods, but I wouldn’t say more than 50% of homeschool children are coming from wealthy families. That’s strictly opinion based on observation at this point, but I bet I can back that up with stats.
dailyindependent
January 6, 2008
Fred not all families are terrorists trying
to breed religious fanatics. Again look at
the numbers our education system fails the kids.
Try
http://www.chec.org/Legastive/News/HomeschoolingStatis
tics
I would want my kids to have that advantage,
simple truth is were dumbing our kids down in
public school to the point where there not
capable of passing a test to graduate school let
alone read. The larger colleges are recruiting
homeschoolers because they are simply smarter
than public school students. They are taught
the Three R’s, yes its up to the parent to teach
but in public schools its up to a teachers
union and popular vote to what they teach.
Homeschooling allows a child to excell at
there own pace and arent just another check
to ssusd.
blfrog
January 6, 2008
Were you referring to my comment in your statement about “affluent”? If so, my original statement was, “One could say, ‘How will private school students handle the reality of economic difference between themselves — the affluent and economically privileged — and the majority of the rest of the world?’”
Hope that clears it up. Yes, I’m making an assumption that most private school students are well-off (or that their families are), but I think that’s a fairly safe assumption, yes?
adsoofmelk
January 6, 2008
Here’s one of my experiences in the Colorado Rockies
circa late 1980s. I was invited to lunch by a local
family. After I had sat at the table their two children aged approx. ten sat next to mom & dad and proudly
related how they had achieved the highest scores
at their bible class telling of how humans
and dinosaurs lived together 6,000 years ago. Dad was ecstatic. How are children raised in such a closed,stifling
environment going to survive in the real world?
The moment they open up to someone they’ll
be viewed as nutcases which in fact they will be.
Fred
January 6, 2008
I enjoy the interaction with the home schooled children that come into the library. Most of what I have seen of them, their lessons are structured and no less demanding that what I see in the public school. The children that are home schooled, on a whole, usually shows more self-motivation. I was really impressed, two years ago, with a young lady in her last year of “high school” who came in to do research for a term paper in her English class. As it happened, I was doing research for my own research paper for my English college class. Her paper was much more comprehensive than mine and she was not satisfied with the measly number of works cited that I had. Boy did my ego take a smashing. What is even worse is that I got a “A” on my paper…what on earth did she get on hers?
I, also, have had some home schooled children that caused me great concern. Some parents…very few, I glad to say…would send their children to the library alone at anytime of the day to ‘study’ and they would immediately get on the computers for games.
Some parents fail to realize that as we are a public county library, it is not my job nor even my right to monitor their children’s use of our facilities…and certainly not my job to make sure their children are doing homework. I have had to explain this to parents as well as remind them that their children if not ATTENDING school needs to be under their supervision during school hours or they considered truants. (Same conversation I have had to have with parents of public school kids who “miss” the school bus but think it is okay to hang at the library rather than walk to school.)
Home schooled children, private school children and public school children all seem to have something in common. How hard or cushy their lessons…how well they are taught and what skills are available for them to learn IF THEY WILL still comes down to how good their teachers are; whether teacher is Mr or Ms So-n-so or Mom and Dad. I have lived 62 years and have met many, many teachers in that time, both home schoolers and public. Most of them are the most dedicated hard-working people in the world. My thanks go out to them.
Daily, the site in your opening post seemed to really give a negative view of home schooling. Here are a few more from the other side. LOL.
http://www.midnightbeach.com/hs/Librarian’s_Perspective.html
http://www.midnightbeach.com/hs/research.html
http://www.hslda.org/Default.asp?bhcp=1
http://homeschoolcentral.com/
Ruthie Lancaster
January 6, 2008
I know a lady who has 8 kids and she homeschool’s. Actually I am not sure when she actually schools her children because she says she has to do 8 loads of laundry a day and she’ll anyone who will listen that she is depressed. Whatever.
Last year I attempted to homeschool my son for medical reasons. It didn’t work out very well and I came to conclussion that I can’t homeschool nor do I want to.
When that lady found out I was putting my son in school she made some very rude comments and basically said if I can’t homeschool then I shouldn’t do anything because their must be something wrong with my son and school is not the answer.
Well, he started public school in August and he is doing fabulous! He likes school. He has friends and he is learning.
I’m not against homeschooling. If you can do it my hat is off to you.
But for us public school has been the way to go.
Tamara
January 6, 2008
I do believe that some home schooling is good in some cases but for the ones that are using it for a cop-out. NO!
And if the parents keep up with it.. and do what the rules say… I know of one family that I got pissed off
because they were doing home schooling but the kids slept until noon.. did if any of about 30 mins of work
then off to play.. using the system.. big time cause the parents didn’t have time to drive them down the
hill too the bus stop. And well hate to say it but they were Californians in Colorado.. They finally moved
back to California still kept the home school.. but California was alot more strick and kept account of
the kids that did have this (HS) home school. They had to report every week.. Well I still didn’t like the
fact that the kids weren’t interacting with other kids.. and was afraid they couldn’t handle society. To my
surprise the oldest child is in college holding an A+ and is tutoring high schoolers as well as college students
and is on the honor society roll. She also teaches foreigners English as well as she also teaches Spanish
Her age is… 21yrs. She has been offered a trip to Spain to learn more about the culture, trip completely
paid for. Not only does she hold full time college she works full time as well as tutors… So I have to
eat my words alittle about how I feel about HS. The youngest child is doing well but is now in public school
and is graduating 1 yr ahead of his class. I do agree with HS to some advantage.. But it still comes down
to the Parents to teach them as well. Especially like Jenn said… Manners.. Because of the the adults need
that to be taught to them as well. The kids see and follow the adult’s alot so when they see the negativity
and the hate and non-manners and the adults getting away with it.. they say WHY NOT!!! … So HS is good to
a point for the ones that can’t do the one on one with that special child.. because the teachers don’t have
enough time to do the one on one. I know a little girl that suffered from a brain tumor and after surgery
she was little slower than the other children her age. So they decided that they would HS because they had
more time to work one on one with her and the teachers couldn’t. SO it does work, if not abused.. And for Fred saying a Religious cult… NAW!!!!! Just called on some cases… laziness… Which shows some children.. the wrong idea… But in some like the little girl it will give her a chance to catch up and may just rejoin her class in a few years if that long.. I would like to see them have more qualifications for kids to have HS. And not be so easy for them or their parents to put them in HS. But it is true HS does not help the children socialize with others.
best kept secret
January 6, 2008
Thanks Ruthie and everyone for your posts. I’ll say that my opening post is skeptical, for sure. Tamara, did you smack the person that gave you a hard time for putting your kid in public school? Hehe, and Fred, I’m for teaching evolution, but everyone has a right to believe what they want to believe. I’m sure they have a good reason for it. And Ads, I still don’t buy it that homeschool students come from better financial situations.
dailyindependent
January 7, 2008
Well, I my hand couldn’t reach through the phone to smack her. LOL I just didn’t appreciate her basically calling my son stupid. The fact of the matter was that at 5 years old he wasn’t ready for school. And I discovered that I cannot teach. My son and I are very alike and we constantly butted heads. He wanted to play and I wanted him to do his school work.
Luckily for us California law says children don’t have to do any type of schooling until they are 6 years old. So we put him in kindergarten in August and it’s been great! And I must admit I was scared he would be the only 6 year old in his class. But many of his classmates are 6 and it’s been really nice to see him interact with them and gosh, he’s reading! It’s so cool when he reads to me!
Public school has been very good for our family.
Tamara
January 7, 2008
Tamara, I went to college online and I feel that has a lot in common with home schooling…(as a matter of fact, home schooling does have the opportunity to do a lot of classes online.) Some people can handle it and others need to go in a more traditional direction. I’m glad you gave home schooling a try and gladder still that you followed the decision you knew was right. No one who doesn’t live in your skin has the right to second guess you or criticize your decisions. Yours was one case where “Mother knew best”> LOL
Ruthie Lancaster
January 7, 2008
You’re still misreading my comment, man! Okay, to be more clear, I was basically saying that *private schoolers* are better-off financially than the average person.
Homeschoolers, as far as I know, are probably below the average income because at least one parent stays home full-time (or close to full-time).
Hope that helps.
adsoofmelk
January 7, 2008
You’re right Ads, I must’ve misread that.
dailyindependent
January 7, 2008
adsoofmelk
You are way off… Because if you read what I said earlier… those ppl I was talking about.. live in a $700,000 home and make very good money… they are far above the below average person. They didn’t want to put the kids in a private school reasons I do not know.. So you can’t just say the ones that home school are below average because they are not… The little girl I mentioned.. well her dad works for the government and makes darn good money… far about what you are saying… so you need to get our point.. I am not sure what planet your on… oh yea.. from hearing from others the same as Fred… LOL….
best kept secret
January 10, 2008
The point I tried but apparently failed to make
is that it matters WHY parents home school their
children. Is it for the childrens’ benefit or for the parents’ benefit?
Fred
January 10, 2008
Please give me a break. Home schooling is not
just for he rich. I know several families who
homeschool and re in middle class or below.
Again both families children are well educated.
Money is not an issue for either family its
the difference in education that matters.
blfrog
January 11, 2008
Fred, how would it be to the parent’s benefit? Outside of feeling they are doing the best for their children. Thinking back to the days my children were in school, I think I would have felt like a prisoner if I had been forced to stay at home and monitor their school work all day…plus I could not have afforded that pleasure if I wanted to work and provide all the luxuries like rent, utilities and food. LOL. Thinking about it, I believe that, like Tamara, I don’t have it in me to be a teacher.
I believe that home schooling is a great benefit to the children…or it is a benefit to no one. It really all comes back to the dedication of the teachers…parents or other wise. I still believe that a teacher-student ratio of 1 to 1, 1to 2, 3 or4 has to be a plus.
One point I almost forgot…a couple of families that homeschool here in Trona, I noticed they are not at all embarrassed to admit their short coming…academically speaking. They are not adverse to having their children tutored in subjects they feel they, themselves, are weak in.
Ruthie Lancaster
January 12, 2008
to Ruthie: Once again I say it matters WHY parents want to home school their kids. Is it okay with you if a dad home schools his daughter to be his sex toy? Or some
radical Muslim home schools his boy to be a suicide bomber?
What about a mentally ill schizoid parent home schooling
his/her offspring to become a cult member? When this whole home schooling thing first made the news I was and still am highly suspicious of it because of it’s propensity for abuse. It’s my personal opinion that pubescent kids should be fixed like cats & dogs and later have to get government permission to be rendered fertile. A driver’s license is needed to operate an automobile. The same
should be required of prospective parents. Getting knocked up does’nt require rocket science. Sperm meets
egg and suddenly you’re supposed to be worshipped
as a ‘parent? Gimme a break.
Fred
January 16, 2008
Why Fred how does the parents benefit? They
spend more time with there kids and teach them.
There is no blessed time with out the kids
during the day. It requires one parent
teaching most of the day and attending meetings
to help them teach better. They pay money for
the books an sports programs and other items.
I would think that parents choose it for there
kids to have a better education.
blfrog
January 17, 2008
I am a blessed woman. Out of all of the thousands of people I have met and interacted with all of my life I can count on my fingers…and have fingers left over people who were as slimey and dangerous as the kind you named.
You must have been exposed to a more than
I have to be so skeptical of a parents motives.
Ruthie Lancaster
January 18, 2008
Fred is a very sick person.
So-belle
January 18, 2008
to blfrog: I can only speak from personal
experience. The home schooling experience I thru
a miracle lived thru during my childhood,me now at
age 62 gives me nightmares four nights out of each week.
It is like being caught in a Twilight Zone episode
endless loop replay. Same theme every time with
variations. I am a little boy left alone in some
hellish location. Could be an airport terminal teeming with people. Or the bad section in some town,city or foreign nation. Even a 1950s movie theater. Usually,I am out on the street in a darkened neighborhood. It’s night and freezing cold and I have only my child’s shirt,pants and shoes.
I have no money. My parents have driven far from
home,dumped me in this strange Place and driven
away. I have been totally abandoned and left
to die. This is why I have always had rescued cats and now have ten of them. Each was born into a human
family then during kittenhood driven far from home,dumped and left to die. Don’t expect me to give parenthood carta blanch.
Fred
January 18, 2008
Fred:
Cats are truly wonderful creatures that generate the spirit of the night.
Chesus K. Reist
January 20, 2008
I websearched home schooling,found this
http://panachereport.com/channels/more%20short%20stories/5yearoldmom.htm
Fred
January 20, 2008
Fred I understand that you childhood was poor.
But really calling parents who homeschool,
are teaching their kids to be a bedroom person
is ridiculous. There are bad people in any
system but most are generally good people who
want better for there kids.
blfrog
January 21, 2008
Fred give me a break. That was 1933
how does that relate to now or home schooling???
blfrog
January 22, 2008
I’ll get to the point. Public schools have gotten the blame
for students’ failing. That’s baloney. You could
pay a teacher a million bucks and he/she
could’nt d0 diddly with the idiot offspring
of stupid parents. If you want reality not wishfull illusion;talk to cops,teachers and social workers. They know the score. It’s not the school and school teachers who’ve dumbed-down since we oldtimers were kidS.
It’s the new generation of parents who’re handing chopped liver to schools and demanding it be made into
sirloin. There never has been a time thruout the history of humanity when parents wer’nt allowed to home school their children. It’s a natural,normal process. It’s just that back in the old days parents instilled common sense into the brats’ heads before they even WENT to school.
My bet is the children of police officers get told of how things really work out there in the real world.
If I had a kid I’d take him on a tour of the county jail at age 10. Then take him into the Welfare Dept or the nearest parole or probation office. To top it off I’d drive him thru Trona. Then I’d tell him “If you don’t study hard and get good grades you’ll end up like these people”.
He’ll study 24/7 from then on.
Fred
January 22, 2008
Fred, you must have had a miserable childhood, but why do you want to judge all parents by what you experienced? One of the reasons many people choose to homeschool their children is to instill the values that have been taken away from public education systems. The right to talk about God, the right to pray, the right to share your faith and belief with others. Until the people of this country get off their duffs and persuade the Supreme court to interpret the Constitution as it was meant to be and tell the ACLU to take a back seat our constitutional rights will continue to be abused.
Yes, there are people who abuse the system by not providing their homeschooled children with an adequate education, but the majority bear the burden of paying for all books, materials, field trips etc. as well as having to pay for the education of their neigbors kids with their taxes. There are homeschool support groups all over the country where the parents share their teaching expertise and knowledge so the kids get a quality, well rounded education. This also gives the kids the social interaction that so many people who criticize homeschooling say they lack. You need to get off of your holier than thou high horse Fred, and admit that your way of life is not the ideal for everyone.
David Van Huss
January 24, 2008
Fred, no doubt your method of childraising would instill the same respect for parents, teachers and other peoples rights as you had instilled in you by your parents.
Ruthie Lancaster
January 27, 2008
Fred the problem is most teachers are there
for the money and nothing else.
blfrog
January 28, 2008
What I really want is to go into partnership
with HAL9000,dominate the planet then the universe
and put a stop to stupid replies to my posts
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_9000
Fred
January 30, 2008
I websearched home schooling again,found this
http://oldies.about.com/od/rockabill1/f/jerryleemyra.htm
Fred
February 2, 2008
Fred. Can you please clarify what homeschooling has to do with this article about Jerry Lee Lewis? I fail to see the relevance here.
David Van Huss
February 10, 2008
to David Huss: It’s the property thing that worries me. Home schooling is the heart of whacko religoids.
I believ when confronted by this sort of debacle that government should take over child rearing. It’s a duty to humanity. Combine schiophrenic religoids with children and you’ve got a Children of God cult scenario. I mean,if you’ve got parents who’re baying at the moon the potential for rampant incest is a non-sequitor. Color me normal. I’ve been paying attention to what’s going on out there. Home schooling is just a cover for religoid fathers in company with subservient wives to incest their children.
Fred
May 15, 2008